Worst final boss ever. Her danmaku is bland, her name is bland (it simply means "pure fox"), her ability is bland... etc etc. Nothing on her stands out. It's like ZUN didn't even try.
She still has a chance of growing on me, but I doubt it. For now she is a void of a character.
Worst final boss ever. Her danmaku is bland, her name is bland (it simply means "pure fox"), her ability is bland... etc etc. Nothing on her stands out. It's like ZUN didn't even try.
She still has a chance of growing on me, but I doubt it. For now she is a void of a character.
So, basically, she's a PC-98 character in the Windows Era? /Danmaku Fired ;)
In seriousness, though, I look forward to the backstory behind the new characters, particularly of our "Moon Yukari" here (I'm sorry, but that's all I see when I see her. The "fox" angle definitely doesn't help). I find them all to be very intriguing.
So, basically, she's a PC-98 character in the Windows Era? /Danmaku Fired ;)
In seriousness, though, I look forward to the backstory behind the new characters, particularly of our "Moon Yukari" here (I'm sorry, but that's all I see when I see her. The "fox" angle definitely doesn't help). I find them all to be very intriguing.
She's supposed to be one-dimensional, I think. In a way, she actually purified OUT any significant dimensions to her character so she's basically just pure wrath now.
(despite this, she's apparently actual friends with Hecatia, anyways... mostly out of shared wrath)
Her spell card names also make it very clear their simplicity is on purpose. She even explicitly says she just wants to kill you instead of waste time with beautiful danmaku int he extra stage.
Although it's an odd design choice for a final boss instead of a minor character, that's for sure.
I suppose, it's more of a case of "holding back", except instead of it being the spell card rules, it's just her own will. ...as far as the plot is concerned. Considering that... when I first saw her stage, I saw the red Earth(?) and thought immediately of Giygas. I was reading up on the creepy character on a while back. I really want to see that Giygas connection made, now. With this information, I wonder if it crossed ZUN mind and he made it look reminiscent of it on purpose? Naturally, we'll never know the answer to that, though..
So from what I gather from the plot, Junko's pretty much the embodiment of a middle finger directed at the moon civilization, and her plot in this game involves throwing hell at them in the most literal way she could manage. This same plot apparently also involved sending over someone who's very nature and dress code MEGATROLLS the moon civ's higher-ups.
I may be going off the rail here, but I would liken it to Koishi's lack of consciousness. Or Akuma from Street Fighter, or something. While Koishi is thought to have possibly achieved perfect emptiness and enlightenment and is driven by nothing, Junko has instead achieved pure emotion, the emotion of hatred. Like Junko, Koishi may be said to have "purified" herself. Junko is supposed to be non-descript, nameless. She doesn't even have a character title. She's less a person, and more a force of nature, anymore. The embodiment of a middle fighter flipping off the Lunarians like someone said is a good way to put it.
you'd think that her attacks being very simple (almost traditional) in a world of complicated and even complex patterns would scream "distinct", but noooo
"bland" means "i don't like it", and value judgements equals opinionated drivel
(she doesn't even have a title, because she deleted it from reality
I don't know. Personally, I like her design, but it still feels like something is missing. Maybe the spirit of wrath and desire for revenge refined to absolution should have slightly more creepy or ominous appearance. If there was more "killing intent" shown, aside from energy tails, then combined with her smile it would work just like that.
Illustrations aside, I can't wait for fan works. Her character seems rather serious compared to most of Touhou staff.
I've always liked the various types of Chinese dresses, so appearance wise, she's one of my favorites in this game. The Chinese dress seems, to me, to fit very well with her being a spirit, especially since Divine spirits have sort of become the new thing of interest after all.
Hmm...I wonder if Yoshika will try to eat her like the non-bodied ones if she meets her...
Edit: Now that I've seen her in action, I still think she's fine. She might not be the most visually pleasing like some people (Meiling's "rainbow flower" was simply beautiful), but she still holds to her motif. Also, I really like her spiral lasers.
I'm not sure how can you call her "bland". Maybe her name, but "Junko" isn't any more simple than Miko, Futo, or Aya. The design is actually fairly good, in my opinion (although the tails could have been more "serpent-like"). She's definitely my second favorite in this game, after Sagume.
I'm not sure how can you call her "bland". Maybe her name, but "Junko" isn't any more simple than Miko, Futo, or Aya. The design is actually fairly good, in my opinion (although the tails could have been more "serpent-like"). She's definitely my second favorite in this game, after Sagume.
Her design is fine. Sorry, I was just in a bad mood when I wrote the OP. But I think it's better if I wait for ZUN to expand this character more before I say anything else.
Her danmaku still sucks, though. They're pretty much only boring bullet rings. It feels like you're fighting a boss made by a random, amateur danmakufu coder, not ZUN. He can do much better than this.
Well, at least this being is definitely not her anymore,and i consider this as if she, since she's a spirit, is an Inverse Spirit. Any flaks that she takes would only apply to this being and not her original identity. If it was not for the tragedy, she could have used more beautiful attacks just like any other characters, but also if it wasn't for the tragedy, the story of TH15 would not be LoLK, but other else.
By that, i believe that her true identity does not look like this, is an ordinary being, and actually is a good, if not a great mom. That identity as well is not a part of the Touhou Universe of course.
(It is as well true to me that this character brings to us several questions. Plus, i theorize that ZUN is thinking of and creating unused patterns for bosses and it happened that he gave such a simple pattern fitting to her personality. Attack Patterns and the Theme also make the identity of a character)
Well, at least this being is definitely not her anymore,and i consider this as if she, since she's a spirit, is an Inverse Spirit. Any flaks that she takes would only apply to this being and not her original identity. If it was not for the tragedy, she could have used more beautiful attacks just like any other characters, but also if it wasn't for the tragedy, the story of TH15 would not be LoLK, but other else.
By that, i believe that her true identity does not look like this, is an ordinary being, and actually is a good, if not a great mom. That identity as well is not a part of the Touhou Universe of course.
(It is as well true to me that this character brings to us several questions. Plus, i theorize that ZUN is thinking of and creating unused patterns for bosses and it happened that he gave such a simple pattern fitting to her personality. Attack Patterns and the Theme also make the identity of a character)
Then by your logic, Koishi is also nothing like her original satori self and shouldn't be counted as the same person, when much part of her story is about how she tries to return back her emotions. I don't think you can rule out the existence of an individual's past personality whenever plot tools like this came to play. We are simply getting the Junko that went through all the shits that happened to her, cranked up to 11 with her specific ability that enables her to do so. I also think there's no need to question her being once a good mom, as everything she did won't happen if she wasn't one. Although her sick obsession made her forget all that, which is a mistake she can't undo and is her character's flaws. Even so, as pure hatred as she is, she can communicate just fine with anyone that isn't a Lunarian anyway. So chances are she may not lose all of her old personality when she's interacting with Hecatia, Clownpiece or other Gensokyo residents.
Remember that ZUN shaped the game(stages, boss fight) revolving around the music. And since the music is usually a representation of the owner's characters, what happened with Junko actually makes sense.
[KN] said:
I'm not sure how can you call her "bland". Maybe her name, but "Junko" isn't any more simple than Miko, Futo, or Aya. The design is actually fairly good, in my opinion (although the tails could have been more "serpent-like"). She's definitely my second favorite in this game, after Sagume.
Hey, same taste with me. Sagume is great, especially with that ability.
People can say what they want to, (not trying to be mean or rude), but this is the best final boss that I have ever seen in Touhou. Her backstory is great, sad, her personality is "powerful," I guess you could say. Besides, her danmaku isn't THAT bland. Her danmaku and personal identity was purified by her own self to become even stronger, perhaps. She's mainly a huge ball of rage, fury, and sadness, which probably gave ZUN a long time to figure out? Also, she's a fox. Being a nine tailed fox, like Ran is pretty cool. But the tails are made of energy, which is kinda boring. Still, she is a cool boss.
Also, she's a fox. Being a nine tailed fox, like Ran is pretty cool. But the tails are made of energy, which is kinda boring. Still, she is a cool boss.
Her name, "pure fox", comes from some actual mythological person with the same name that is related to Houyi and Chang'e, but she isn't a fox like Ran, and those aren't fox tails despite people here tagging them as such (and there are 7 of them).
People can say what they want to, (not trying to be mean or rude), but this is the best final boss that I have ever seen in Touhou. Her backstory is great, sad, her personality is "powerful," I guess you could say. Besides, her danmaku isn't THAT bland. Her danmaku and personal identity was purified by her own self to become even stronger, perhaps. She's mainly a huge ball of rage, fury, and sadness, which probably gave ZUN a long time to figure out? Also, she's a fox. Being a nine tailed fox, like Ran is pretty cool. But the tails are made of energy, which is kinda boring. Still, she is a cool boss.
[KN] said:
Her name, "pure fox", comes from some actual mythological person with the same name that is related to Houyi and Chang'e, but she isn't a fox like Ran, and those aren't fox tails despite people here tagging them as such (and there are 7 of them).
From this site, it listed 2 in particular. One of them was Chang'e during the rule of Emperor Yao, who ordered Houyi to shoot down the 10 suns. Then, either in a different myth or later after the death of Emperor Yao during the Xia era/dynasty(during this time, Houyi is a god), his wive is named Gensai, who also goes by another name, "Junko". (Yes, same kanji as Touhou Junko, so her name already means "pure fox"). Still not fox tails, but you can think of it as some design liberties.
There's even a Japanese Wikipedia entry for Gensai, where the "Junko" here is described to be a "fair woman with beautiful black hair". Not the blonde lady we have here.
But rather than that, I find this tidbits more interesting:
According to some sources, it was mentioned that "Junko" was Chang'e's childhood name. She changed her name to Chang'e when she was older.
Her name, "pure fox", comes from some actual mythological person with the same name that is related to Houyi and Chang'e, but she isn't a fox like Ran, and those aren't fox tails despite people here tagging them as such (and there are 7 of them).
I actually meant to put "fox-like energy tails" but, that's just me being human. Mistakes are mistakes /:
New theory: Junko IS Chang'e :V For some unknown reason, Chang'e made Houyi kill her children, then went mad for the emotional pain and after purifying her rage Junko was separated from Chang'e as a new being, so both of them exist. Junko used this name because it was her previous name, and is basically trying to kill herself for something that she did TO HERSELF, but without knowing it.
New theory: Junko IS Chang'e :V For some unknown reason, Chang'e made Houyi kill her children, then went mad for the emotional pain and after purifying her rage Junko was separated from Chang'e as a new being, so both of them exist. Junko used this name because it was her previous name, and is basically trying to kill herself for something that she did TO HERSELF, but without knowing it.
Ok, that probably makes no real sense.
Why are legends so complicated...
It may make sense if you think of it like this. Heavy emphasis on "may"(spoiler'ed just in case someone haven't finished LoLK):
As we all know "Junko" is an embodiment of resentment, particularly of the "original", live Junko. But what if it's actually not just her hatred, and instead the hatred of those people killed by Houyi. Which among them are Bo Feng and the others who also died because of the fallen 10 suns. And then depending on the legends, these people tried to retaliate against Houyi and was killed. Perhaps even during this, live "Junko" was also actually killed.
It's then that "Junko" came into shape and murdered Houyi.
However, what if Chang'e's grudge also became a part of "Junko"'s resentment towards Houyi? It's because that, according to their legend, after Houyi shot down the 10 suns, he went on an affair with the River Goddesses, which saddened Chang'e and forced her to leave him out of feeling bertrayed. This happened before she drank the immortality elixir and float to the moon. Thus, potentially before "Junko" murdered Houyi.
If we take that into account, then Chang'e's grudge might be a part of "Junko", and can potentially affect her appearance. So maybe, we've been looking at Chang'e this whole time.
Suddenly all the "Are you watching, Chang'e!?" and Chang'e supposedly being unaware of "Junko" gives out a different meaning.
This is purely speculation, of course. But with all the mixup ZUN made with those different legends, I can see how this may just work.