The reason I want American ships in the game (I know, I know) is for moments like these.
I mean, shit, Tanaka could do the lame thing and only put in ships that fought exclusively in the Atlantic or that were eventually transferred to the JMSDF later on or even only ships that were sunk by Japan and I'd be happy.
Because, imagine all the doujins:
"Fufufu, kowai ka?"
*USS Quincy makes the same face that Roma makes above*
The reason I want American ships in the game (I know, I know) is for moments like these.
I mean, shit, Tanaka could do the lame thing and only put in ships that fought exclusively in the Atlantic or that were eventually transferred to the JMSDF later on or even only ships that were sunk by Japan and I'd be happy.
Because, imagine all the doujins:
"Fufufu, kowai ka?"
*USS Quincy makes the same face that Roma makes above*
As much as I'd like them, American ships, however they were implemented, would result in weirdness like sortieing Akagi and Kaga with Avengers or equipping Nagato with the 16''/45+Mk38 FCS from North Carolina-class. Balance and tone issues everywhere. It's a real can of worms.
Personally I wouldn't mind, but if I had to guess I would say they want the game to remain mostly IJN themed. They'll probably implement EN at some point, though.
I'd be very surprised if they included any American (or other Allied, I'd love to see some of the artists tackle Force Z) ships any time soon. Certainly not before they've exhausted the IJN roster. There's still quite a few destroyers to go, but they've pretty much run out of heavier ships. We'll probably see more Germans and Italians, one or two in every event. I'd love to get some more cruisers, maybe give Prinz her Hipper-neesan.
The reason I want American ships in the game (I know, I know) is for moments like these.
I mean, shit, Tanaka could do the lame thing and only put in ships that fought exclusively in the Atlantic or that were eventually transferred to the JMSDF later on or even only ships that were sunk by Japan and I'd be happy.
Because, imagine all the doujins:
"Fufufu, kowai ka?"
*USS Quincy makes the same face that Roma makes above*
The only issue being it wasn't like Tenryu managed this alone, it's kind of hard to brag when it was actually you (whose small) and two or three of your buddies who are nearly the same size as the other guy ganging up on him. If she had managed to set up some kind of ambush or had only DDs supporting her or something it would be impressive, but the ship was being racked by gun fire from two or three heavy cruisers at point blank range at the time and was also torpedoed by at least one other vessel.
Most of the hate from Savo IMO would be directed at Chokai although her own ignominious end (possibly destroyed by a golden BB from the tail gun on a CVE) might help sooth the burn.
aceofspudz said:
As much as I'd like them, American ships, however they were implemented, would result in weirdness like sortieing Akagi and Kaga with Avengers or equipping Nagato with the 16''/45+Mk38 FCS from North Carolina-class. Balance and tone issues everywhere. It's a real can of worms.
Personally I wouldn't mind, but if I had to guess I would say they want the game to remain mostly IJN themed. They'll probably implement EN at some point, though.
As opposed to Kaga going out with Stukas or Nagato going out with 15 inch German guns and 90mm Italian secondary batteries?
Blue_Trident said:
I'd be very surprised if they included any American (or other Allied, I'd love to see some of the artists tackle Force Z)ships any time soon.
IIRC The devs have outright confirmed they want to do them reasonably soon during Q&As IIRC. A good bit of the player base seems to want it because quite frankly the allied ships just have much more interesting history and gameplay possibilities then most of what they're actually getting.
LoweGear said:
Harder shows up.
*Naval Base becomes a ghost town*
Na, submarines might make people jumpy. It's when this lot shows up then everyone cheeses it.
Tk3997 said: IIRC The devs have outright confirmed they want to do them reasonably soon during Q&As IIRC. A good bit of the player base seems to want it because quite frankly the allied ships just have much more interesting history and gameplay possibilities then most of what they're actually getting.
Source please? I have a hard time believing Tanaka and friends would even broach the idea of adding USN kanmusu without getting lynched.
Source please? I have a hard time believing Tanaka and friends would even broach the idea of adding USN kanmusu without getting lynched.
Nah I can see it being acceptable, even if there's for sure going to be a small contingent of whiny netouyo -- Modern Japan seems to be all about 'yesterday's enemies can be today's friends'. I vaguely remember some old dudes in either Korea or China grasping at straws and calling Kancolle (or was it GuP?) revanchist propaganda, and *even in the remote chance that's true* it could still allow Kancolle to be Allied-friendly and Allied shipgirl-friendly. The Japan-US MDT is a serious thing after all, and unlike with a certain country further south, the US actually takes an active pro-Japan position in territorial disputes with you-know-who. Hell, there's even a hilarious set of affairs where American TTKs (at least one confirmed that I know of) are playing our favorite shipgirl game right in Yokosuka, as serving members of the USN. That doesn't mean allied kanmusu confirmed, obviously, but I if it did happen I'm sure most Japanese fans would find the reasoning acceptable
The only issue being it wasn't like Tenryu managed this alone, it's kind of hard to brag when it was actually you (whose small) and two or three of your buddies who are nearly the same size as the other guy ganging up on him. If she had managed to set up some kind of ambush or had only DDs supporting her or something it would be impressive, but the ship was being racked by gun fire from two or three heavy cruisers at point blank range at the time and was also torpedoed by at least one other vessel.
A lot of the in-game lines and scenarios in doujins are exaggerated for dramatic and comedic effect -- I chose Tenryuu and Quincy because it would be funny, because right now Tenryuu is a buttmonkey and characterized as a chuuni and that would be an actual scenario where someone could write a situation where another kanmusu could actually take her seriously. If Quincy isn't exactly *afraid* of Tenryuu she could still be drawn/written feel disgust (in a funny way) while meeting her, and still have Roma or Littorio's face above. I love those faces, they are well-drawn and really funny, even though technically Graf Zeppelin was sitting in an empty bathtub twiddling her thumbs when Roma got bombed
are they allowed to do that? not the whole playing a ww2 ship game since people tend to get over those things but the whole playing a random browser game while on active duty
I thought the military would be a lot more strict about those things
are they allowed to do that? not the whole playing a ww2 ship game since people tend to get over those things but the whole playing a random browser game while on active duty
I thought the military would be a lot more strict about those things
What you can get away with depends on your job. Also, you're not on the job 24/7
quite frankly the allied ships just have much more interesting history and gameplay possibilities then most of what they're actually getting.
The weird thing about the Allied ships is that the most iconic ones were those in victory fleets that didn't go down in a blaze of glory like many of the IJN's.
Many of the USN capitals especially were relatively isolated from danger by superior tactics and technology and to be even remotely realistic the likes of Enterprise would have to have quite a few lines referring to how effortlessly they dominated their enemy or in a few cases admit how little action they actually saw.
Not really sure how that could be interesting, though having a BB or CA that acts like an obvious greenhorn would be refreshing.
Source please? I have a hard time believing Tanaka and friends would even broach the idea of adding USN kanmusu without getting lynched.
It was in a Famitsu interview back in 2013 and is pretty well known among players, he said he wanted to add American, English, German, etc. shipgirls. Yes, he specifically said American, English, and German shipgirls.
Many of the USN capitals especially were relatively isolated from danger by superior tactics and technology and to be even remotely realistic the likes of Enterprise would have to have quite a few lines referring to how effortlessly they dominated their enemy or in a few cases admit how little action they actually saw.
That is, to put it nicely, an ignorant opinion. In case you aren't trolling and are interested in learning about the USN in the Pacific War, here's some pretty good popular histories on the subject:
"Pacific Crucible: War at Sea in the Pacific, 1941-1942: War at Sea in the Pacific, 1941-1942"
"Enterprise: America's Fightingest Ship and the Men Who Helped Win World War II"
Having said that, I highly doubt they're going to put in all US shipgirls. Making up separate appearances and personalities for 175 different destroyers all in the same class would just be an exercise in futility. Especially since only 113 frontline destroyers were ever commissioned into the Japanese Navy in this timeframe.
I get the meaning, and I don't want to be picky, but wasn't the Italian battleship torpedoed by Albacores the *Vittorio Veneto*?
Wrong Albacore. He's talking about the USS Albacore, a Gato-class submarine known for sinking the largest tonnage of shipping in the war, including Taiho, Tenryuu, Ooshio, and Sazanami, plus several freighters. (As opposed to the Faery Albacore, the British carrier-borne biplane torpedo bomber.)
She was called "The White Devil", and had a dark reputation even among the American base, but she was a terror to Japanese morale.
NNescio said:
Albacore shows up.
*Naval Base is flooded with bilge water*
Read: Pee
LoweGear said:
Harder shows up.
*Naval Base becomes a ghost town*
There are quite a few American subs that scored extreme kills, actually.
Cavalla was twinned up with Albacore as "The Black Devil", and sank the Shoukaku, as well as another unimplemented Japanese destroyer, Shimotsuki.
Sealion II sank Kongou, which was also the last battleship to ever sink to a submarine.
Flasher sank 21 Japanese ships, the high score in terms of total number, which isn't half-bad for a ship that wasn't commissioned until the war was half-over.
Wahoo knows where you live. After spotting a Japanese convoy near New Zealand, she crippled the Harusame (which survived only by beaching), then sank all the freighters over the course of several days through dogged trailing. She came across another convoy just after, but had already expended her entire torpedo complement, and was forced to run when destroyers broke up the deck gun party.
Dace and Darter together managed to spot the Central Force when the whole Japanese battle plan hinged upon the Central Force performing a sneak attack during the critical battle of Leyte Gulf. The pair then went in to sink Atago and Maya, and damaged Takao. Atago was the flagship of the operation, and Atago sank so quickly, Admiral Kurita had to swim for his life, ultimately winding up setting his flag on Yamato, which left him so far behind during the actual order of battle during the hilarious Battle Off Samar that he was confusing destroyers for heavy cruisers.
In fact, as was joked in the official Fubuki-centric manga, American submarines basically managed to scratch around 1/3rd of the destroyers (and a good number of other major IJN ships), leading to a whole class of girls with sub trauma.
I vaguely remember some old dudes in either Korea or China grasping at straws and calling Kancolle (or was it GuP?) revanchist propaganda, and *even in the remote chance that's true* it could still allow Kancolle to be Allied-friendly and Allied shipgirl-friendly.
It's certainly not so bad most people would make a stink about it, but KanColle definitely does NOT mention war crimes, while mentioning all the positives, which is functionally a whitewashing. For example, Ikazuchi and Inazuma are given backstory and characterized by their rescue of enemy sailors. Nobody mentions the POWs that were tortured or executed if they were even picked up at all on other ships. (Granted, most WW2 games just assume you know the Nazis were bad and don't mention the concentration camps, either, even without being part of an Axis country...)
In general, they don't mention anything even related to the warcrimes, so the absence isn't so notable.
The Akutan Zero that Hoppo always goes on about was actually shot down because it was strafing survivors, which was a war crime part of the story that doesn't get mentioned, although losing a plane to start with isn't much of a thing they were bragging about.
Probably the most notable to me is Yuudachi's false white flag, which is justified as the captain thinking, "Oh, we totally thought the 2000-ton ship would go faster if we tied white bedsheets up as 'sails', I had no idea you'd interpret that as a white flag while we sailed up alongside your ships and fired upon them!" Yuudachi's entire reputation is essentially built upon this event, and it basically resulted in a "No Quarter" order given (which meant the US did not accept surrender or rescue sailors unless the captain was ignoring orders) until Halsey was back in charge. That her Kai Ni overtly references this and they make her the goofy comic relief destroyer seems rather brazen.
It's certainly not so bad most people would make a stink about it, but KanColle definitely does NOT mention war crimes, while mentioning all the positives, which is functionally a whitewashing. For example, Ikazuchi and Inazuma are given backstory and characterized by their rescue of enemy sailors. Nobody mentions the POWs that were tortured or executed if they were even picked up at all on other ships. (Granted, most WW2 games just assume you know the Nazis were bad and don't mention the concentration camps, either, even without being part of an Axis country...)
In general, they don't mention anything even related to the warcrimes, so the absence isn't so notable.
The Akutan Zero that Hoppo always goes on about was actually shot down because it was strafing survivors, which was a war crime part of the story that doesn't get mentioned, although losing a plane to start with isn't much of a thing they were bragging about.
Probably the most notable to me is Yuudachi's false white flag, which is justified as the captain thinking, "Oh, we totally thought the 2000-ton ship would go faster if we tied white bedsheets up as 'sails', I had no idea you'd interpret that as a white flag while we sailed up alongside your ships and fired upon them!" Yuudachi's entire reputation is essentially built upon this event, and it basically resulted in a "No Quarter" order given (which meant the US did not accept surrender or rescue sailors unless the captain was ignoring orders) until Halsey was back in charge. That her Kai Ni overtly references this and they make her the goofy comic relief destroyer seems rather brazen.
Why would a game about cute ship girls mention war crimes? This is something I never understood, why do people expect KanColle to be something that it was never meant to be and over-exaggerate its significance or its theme.
It makes just as much sense to accuse the IL2 Strumovick series of simulators of whitewashing stalinism and nazism because you can fly WW2 planes and take apart in campaigns based on the battle of berlin, for example. Or participate in bomber flights in which you take apart in mass bombardments of urban centers.
Its a game thats more about ships than it is about world war 2, and given that we have battles set in the Curry Sea where shipgirls fight alien-ghosts of ships, it does a lot to keep separate from the actual history beyond what pertains to the ships themselves.
Why would a game about cute ship girls mention war crimes? This is something I never understood, why do people expect KanColle to be something that it was never meant to be and over-exaggerate its significance or its theme.
Because there are people that just want to start a flame war or nationalistic dick waving. I just take it at face value that this is a game about cute shipgirls fighting aliens. Nothing more, nothing less.
I would like to see the USN ships myself. But mark my words there are going to be assholes that will begin a USN vs IJN flamewar because this is the internet.
Because there are people that just want to start a flame war or nationalistic dick waving. I just take it at face value that this is a game about cute shipgirls fighting aliens. Nothing more, nothing less.
I would like to see the USN ships myself. But mark my words there are going to be assholes that will begin a USN vs IJN flamewar because this is the internet.
Not to rain on your parade, but it's already started. Thankfully, the (lone) guy's being collectively bashed by gamers and non-gamers alike for being a poor sport.
Thing is, how exactly would you balance something like an Essex.
Lexington carried an 110-strong airwing during Okinawa, the standard was 100. Add on the 20% Kancolle bonus plane capacity and you are looking at 130 planes in something like 36/36/36/22. Essex with her named Hellcat fighter squadron would cheese any air superiority requirement and still have room for a slot or two of bombers.
Then there's kit like 5"/38, VT shells, 40mm bofors, Hedgehog launchers, and the all important radar and sonar.
Thing is, how exactly would you balance something like an Essex.
Lexington carried an 110-strong airwing during Okinawa, the standard was 100. Add on the 20% Kancolle bonus plane capacity and you are looking at 130 planes in something like 36/36/36/22. Essex with her named Hellcat fighter squadron would cheese any air superiority requirement and still have room for a slot or two of bombers.
Then there's kit like 5"/38, VT shells, 40mm bofors, Hedgehog launchers, and the all important radar and sonar.
That's very simple, only add the most famous ships like Big E and/or drop only if you don't have them already and limit the equipment either by making them reward only or do it like with the cranes kai 2 and lock equipment behind one time only quests.
Wrong Albacore. He's talking about the USS Albacore, a Gato-class submarine known for sinking the largest tonnage of shipping in the war, including Taiho, Tenryuu, Ooshio, and Sazanami, plus several freighters. (As opposed to the Faery Albacore, the British carrier-borne biplane torpedo bomber.)
She was called "The White Devil", and had a dark reputation even among the American base, but she was a terror to Japanese morale.
There are quite a few American subs that scored extreme kills, actually.
Cavalla was twinned up with Albacore as "The Black Devil", and sank the Shoukaku, as well as another unimplemented Japanese destroyer, Shimotsuki.
Sealion II sank Kongou, which was also the last battleship to ever sink to a submarine.
Flasher sank 21 Japanese ships, the high score in terms of total number, which isn't half-bad for a ship that wasn't commissioned until the war was half-over.
Wahoo knows where you live. After spotting a Japanese convoy near New Zealand, she crippled the Harusame (which survived only by beaching), then sank all the freighters over the course of several days through dogged trailing. She came across another convoy just after, but had already expended her entire torpedo complement, and was forced to run when destroyers broke up the deck gun party.
Dace and Darter together managed to spot the Central Force when the whole Japanese battle plan hinged upon the Central Force performing a sneak attack during the critical battle of Leyte Gulf. The pair then went in to sink Atago and Maya, and damaged Takao. Atago was the flagship of the operation, and Atago sank so quickly, Admiral Kurita had to swim for his life, ultimately winding up setting his flag on Yamato, which left him so far behind during the actual order of battle during the hilarious Battle Off Samar that he was confusing destroyers for heavy cruisers.
In fact, as was joked in the official Fubuki-centric manga, American submarines basically managed to scratch around 1/3rd of the destroyers (and a good number of other major IJN ships), leading to a whole class of girls with sub trauma.
Can I have a source for those "White Devil" and "Black Devil" nicknames?
Rather hypocritical of them considering they've both made bootleg Kancolle games in short order.
Shhh, don't mention that, or scary China will get yoooooou~ Yeah, I saw something about that Chinese copy, looked really... off. It looked wrong in so many ways.
Wrong Albacore. He's talking about the USS Albacore, a Gato-class submarine known for sinking the largest tonnage of shipping in the war, including Taiho, Tenryuu, Ooshio, and Sazanami, plus several freighters. (As opposed to the Faery Albacore, the British carrier-borne biplane torpedo bomber.)
She was called "The White Devil", and had a dark reputation even among the American base, but she was a terror to Japanese morale.
There are quite a few American subs that scored extreme kills, actually.
Cavalla was twinned up with Albacore as "The Black Devil", and sank the Shoukaku, as well as another unimplemented Japanese destroyer, Shimotsuki.
Sealion II sank Kongou, which was also the last battleship to ever sink to a submarine.
Flasher sank 21 Japanese ships, the high score in terms of total number, which isn't half-bad for a ship that wasn't commissioned until the war was half-over.
Wahoo knows where you live. After spotting a Japanese convoy near New Zealand, she crippled the Harusame (which survived only by beaching), then sank all the freighters over the course of several days through dogged trailing. She came across another convoy just after, but had already expended her entire torpedo complement, and was forced to run when destroyers broke up the deck gun party.
Dace and Darter together managed to spot the Central Force when the whole Japanese battle plan hinged upon the Central Force performing a sneak attack during the critical battle of Leyte Gulf. The pair then went in to sink Atago and Maya, and damaged Takao. Atago was the flagship of the operation, and Atago sank so quickly, Admiral Kurita had to swim for his life, ultimately winding up setting his flag on Yamato, which left him so far behind during the actual order of battle during the hilarious Battle Off Samar that he was confusing destroyers for heavy cruisers.
In fact, as was joked in the official Fubuki-centric manga, American submarines basically managed to scratch around 1/3rd of the destroyers (and a good number of other major IJN ships), leading to a whole class of girls with sub trauma.
USS Dace also had another ship kill to add to her tally; the Eikyo Maru.
Now to wait and see which US sub gets the kanmusu-ification...
There are quite a few American subs that scored extreme kills, actually.
Cavalla was twinned up with Albacore as "The Black Devil", and sank the Shoukaku, as well as another unimplemented Japanese destroyer, Shimotsuki.
Sealion II sank Kongou, which was also the last battleship to ever sink to a submarine.
Flasher sank 21 Japanese ships, the high score in terms of total number, which isn't half-bad for a ship that wasn't commissioned until the war was half-over.
Wahoo knows where you live. After spotting a Japanese convoy near New Zealand, she crippled the Harusame (which survived only by beaching), then sank all the freighters over the course of several days through dogged trailing. She came across another convoy just after, but had already expended her entire torpedo complement, and was forced to run when destroyers broke up the deck gun party.
Dace and Darter together managed to spot the Central Force when the whole Japanese battle plan hinged upon the Central Force performing a sneak attack during the critical battle of Leyte Gulf. The pair then went in to sink Atago and Maya, and damaged Takao. Atago was the flagship of the operation, and Atago sank so quickly, Admiral Kurita had to swim for his life, ultimately winding up setting his flag on Yamato, which left him so far behind during the actual order of battle during the hilarious Battle Off Samar that he was confusing destroyers for heavy cruisers.
In fact, as was joked in the official Fubuki-centric manga, American submarines basically managed to scratch around 1/3rd of the destroyers (and a good number of other major IJN ships), leading to a whole class of girls with sub trauma.
So, if Albacore, Harder or Sealion II get the Kancolle-ification, there may be plenty of sub-phobia mangas...
As for destroyers, should the US' kanmusu roster include USS Johnston then Kumano would be having palpitations...
Having said that, I highly doubt they're going to put in all US shipgirls. Making up separate appearances and personalities for 175 different destroyers all in the same class would just be an exercise in futility. Especially since only 113 frontline destroyers were ever commissioned into the Japanese Navy in this timeframe.
There is such a thing called 'selection by notable events in each ship's history', 'know.
Johnston, Hoel, Laffey (DD-724), Halligan would be among the top candidates for a US DD to be KanColle-ified...
As for cruisers the list would include: Juneau, Indianapolis, Baltimore, Alaska, Vincennes, Quincy and Astoria
Other battleships would be: Washington, South Dakota, Missouri, California, West Virginia, Tennessee and North Carolina.
I just hope I-26 and I-58 don't run afoul with 2 of them, considering what they did in their past lives...
and Hornet is superb. If Konishi do the entire Yorktown class, Enterprise is in crafty hands. Worst you can fear from Konishi is a repeat of Kongou's monkey ears.
Verstanden!Roger that!You are Graf Zeppelin? I'm Roma, nice to meet you.All airplane units, launch!It's okay... they're our allies this time.
Roma was historically sunk by German bombers.I'm having palpitations...Enemy ship spotted!I'm Italia.Ach, fellow ships from abroad. Let's be friends.
